“I never thought I’d say this– but thank you John Tinker for not picking Nathan back then in S8. Thank you, because you weren’t the person who was supposed to write it. I can say this with no malice. It wasn’t the right time. And I’m sure there were reasons we’ll never know as fans for the switch. But big picture, if you couldn’t see it and fight for it, if it wasn’t clear to you, then it wasn’t yours to tell. And you wouldn’t have done it justice, if you didn’t believe it yourself.”
Amen and amen!! This paragraph is everything. I believe it deeply but never could never said it so perfectly. Thank you for saying it, Cara.
Thank you— another long time WCTH friend said same and it’s my favorite paragraph in the whole thing. I literally wrote it last and it was like releasing something— I felt emotional and then just grateful. Reason why we connect so well on all this! Only took days of thinking about it and lots of writing and erasing to get there. But felt right. Hugs
I think I read somewhere that Daniel Lissing told them in S3 he wanted out, but agreed to work parts of S4 & S5 to allow them time to write him out of the show. I think Robin was the showrunner in S2-4, but she was also brought back as a consulting producer for S10 from E7-E12. I wonder if that is when the writers started to see the story shift since LS has said that they came into S10 thinking they were going to write a wedding. Dana co-wrote S11 E6 with Lindsay, not Beth according to the opening credits. I did a similar dive down the writers, directors, showrunners rabbit hole on IG a couple of years ago to track the history & have been keeping up with it ever since. I am really liking the energy the new writers & directors have brought to S10 & S11 & look forward to Dr. Powell's debut as a writer tonight. She's been a diversity consultant on the show since S10 E5 according to IMDB.
Hey there. You know I’m always glad to see your name pop up! I got some similar notes especially on Daniel leaving show— different people have said different things for show runners 1-4. I’ll edit so people who come from here on out will see corrected version. Very cool to know that Dr. Powell being diversity consultant but great to know since when. Robin coming back as Consulting Producer for second half of S10 is also very interesting. Hmmm— I’m just not sure what to think about S10 and when they realized they needed to shift. I might message you privately on another post I’m working on and why that is with something Tira found/shared last year. You both are so good at details. Thanks for sharing friend!
Hmm, well you’ve brought up a new way of thinking about this. I’ve been thinking that I would never be be to say “It was supposed to be this way” or be thankful for they pain of seasons 8-10.5 — but you’re helping me to see it a different way. If JT had written the N/E love story, it wouldn’t have felt right. I know from the clips I’ve seen of N/E’s first dance, this feels right. And like you, every day I wake up and go to sleep feeling so grateful for Lindsay Sturman and the amazing work she has done and continues to do with WCTH
Didn’t you just love that dance? I’m a sucker for a great dance scene and I truly thought it was perfect. I don’t know how many times I’ve rewatched it. I’m not sure we will ever really know why it was switched like that at end of S8 or when it really happened. But thinking that JT wasn’t right guy and that wasn’t right time- but LS and this team now is have given me a lot of peace! Thanks so much for commenting. So sorry for my delayed response. I’ll be better if you come back again :)
This was an interesting retrospective, but I should correct a few things in your chronology. Showrunners for S1&2: Brian Bird and Michael Landon, Jr. S3&4: Robin Bernheim, S5-7: Alfonso Moreno, S8&9: John Tinker. Also, in the current season(11) episode six "Believe" was co-written by Dana Brawer & Lindsay Sturman (Beth Stewart took her place on the H2H podcast).
Thanks! Yep gotten a few great comments on this and I’ll make changes for people that come from here on. Appreciate the notes and making it more accurate!
Brian Bird discussed this on his H2H early last season. When he listed the showrunners, he didn't mention Tony Blake, but he could have been a co-showrunner in season 2. Robin is listed as an executive producer for season 3 & 4.
Great job Cara as always! We all are looking forward to the dance and maybe some redemption from season 6. It’s all about to come out! Elizabeth is going to have to pour out her heart soon. She started last week as she told Nathan that she doesn’t see him in anyone’s shadow. I’m waiting on them to finish it! Last weeks episode helped me see something! We’ve all been impatient with the slow burn, but listening to Elizabeth speak what she wrote in her journal was freeing for me. She’s overcame grief and now, finally now, she’s ready to love Nathan fully! I don’t think people understand grief and the effects it has on your heart! She needed this time to allow herself to be healed and now she can pursue another relationship! It’s now the right time for her! Always look forward to anything you write! Gods blessings!!!
I’m with you. I think the writers and directors have all kind of been hinting at this lightness- this freedom— the bright colors, the smiling, the flirting, the joy. They aren’t weighed down anymore. I still think some harder conversations are coming but from a completely different angle. Before it was, I’m not willing to fall for you, to even explore it, even if I have feelings, because it will hurt too much. Then in S10, she realized how bad it would hurt anyway— just as friends. She’s not even getting all the best parts holding herself back. I think the slowness is really supposed to be more the time period. I’ve got a few different blogs working on all this that I can’t wait to hear what you think. If only I could write every day, all day! Ha. Have a great night— Cara
Hey Jessica. Good point. Can you tell me more about this and the timing. I’m trying to think who this affected and who it didn’t as much. I think it still says an awful lot that it was this good even with that happening. The planning and work put in to that point— know Kevin mentioned having a little more free reign than normal too because of strike. Thanks for commenting! Always like all the different insights and layers. Why I like to blog— others help me think of things I didn’t. Add to it or point out things I could change. It’s awesome!
“I never thought I’d say this– but thank you John Tinker for not picking Nathan back then in S8. Thank you, because you weren’t the person who was supposed to write it. I can say this with no malice. It wasn’t the right time. And I’m sure there were reasons we’ll never know as fans for the switch. But big picture, if you couldn’t see it and fight for it, if it wasn’t clear to you, then it wasn’t yours to tell. And you wouldn’t have done it justice, if you didn’t believe it yourself.”
Amen and amen!! This paragraph is everything. I believe it deeply but never could never said it so perfectly. Thank you for saying it, Cara.
Thank you— another long time WCTH friend said same and it’s my favorite paragraph in the whole thing. I literally wrote it last and it was like releasing something— I felt emotional and then just grateful. Reason why we connect so well on all this! Only took days of thinking about it and lots of writing and erasing to get there. But felt right. Hugs
I think I read somewhere that Daniel Lissing told them in S3 he wanted out, but agreed to work parts of S4 & S5 to allow them time to write him out of the show. I think Robin was the showrunner in S2-4, but she was also brought back as a consulting producer for S10 from E7-E12. I wonder if that is when the writers started to see the story shift since LS has said that they came into S10 thinking they were going to write a wedding. Dana co-wrote S11 E6 with Lindsay, not Beth according to the opening credits. I did a similar dive down the writers, directors, showrunners rabbit hole on IG a couple of years ago to track the history & have been keeping up with it ever since. I am really liking the energy the new writers & directors have brought to S10 & S11 & look forward to Dr. Powell's debut as a writer tonight. She's been a diversity consultant on the show since S10 E5 according to IMDB.
Hey there. You know I’m always glad to see your name pop up! I got some similar notes especially on Daniel leaving show— different people have said different things for show runners 1-4. I’ll edit so people who come from here on out will see corrected version. Very cool to know that Dr. Powell being diversity consultant but great to know since when. Robin coming back as Consulting Producer for second half of S10 is also very interesting. Hmmm— I’m just not sure what to think about S10 and when they realized they needed to shift. I might message you privately on another post I’m working on and why that is with something Tira found/shared last year. You both are so good at details. Thanks for sharing friend!
Happy to help if I can.
Hmm, well you’ve brought up a new way of thinking about this. I’ve been thinking that I would never be be to say “It was supposed to be this way” or be thankful for they pain of seasons 8-10.5 — but you’re helping me to see it a different way. If JT had written the N/E love story, it wouldn’t have felt right. I know from the clips I’ve seen of N/E’s first dance, this feels right. And like you, every day I wake up and go to sleep feeling so grateful for Lindsay Sturman and the amazing work she has done and continues to do with WCTH
Didn’t you just love that dance? I’m a sucker for a great dance scene and I truly thought it was perfect. I don’t know how many times I’ve rewatched it. I’m not sure we will ever really know why it was switched like that at end of S8 or when it really happened. But thinking that JT wasn’t right guy and that wasn’t right time- but LS and this team now is have given me a lot of peace! Thanks so much for commenting. So sorry for my delayed response. I’ll be better if you come back again :)
This was an interesting retrospective, but I should correct a few things in your chronology. Showrunners for S1&2: Brian Bird and Michael Landon, Jr. S3&4: Robin Bernheim, S5-7: Alfonso Moreno, S8&9: John Tinker. Also, in the current season(11) episode six "Believe" was co-written by Dana Brawer & Lindsay Sturman (Beth Stewart took her place on the H2H podcast).
Thanks! Yep gotten a few great comments on this and I’ll make changes for people that come from here on. Appreciate the notes and making it more accurate!
Brian Bird discussed this on his H2H early last season. When he listed the showrunners, he didn't mention Tony Blake, but he could have been a co-showrunner in season 2. Robin is listed as an executive producer for season 3 & 4.
Great job Cara as always! We all are looking forward to the dance and maybe some redemption from season 6. It’s all about to come out! Elizabeth is going to have to pour out her heart soon. She started last week as she told Nathan that she doesn’t see him in anyone’s shadow. I’m waiting on them to finish it! Last weeks episode helped me see something! We’ve all been impatient with the slow burn, but listening to Elizabeth speak what she wrote in her journal was freeing for me. She’s overcame grief and now, finally now, she’s ready to love Nathan fully! I don’t think people understand grief and the effects it has on your heart! She needed this time to allow herself to be healed and now she can pursue another relationship! It’s now the right time for her! Always look forward to anything you write! Gods blessings!!!
I’m with you. I think the writers and directors have all kind of been hinting at this lightness- this freedom— the bright colors, the smiling, the flirting, the joy. They aren’t weighed down anymore. I still think some harder conversations are coming but from a completely different angle. Before it was, I’m not willing to fall for you, to even explore it, even if I have feelings, because it will hurt too much. Then in S10, she realized how bad it would hurt anyway— just as friends. She’s not even getting all the best parts holding herself back. I think the slowness is really supposed to be more the time period. I’ve got a few different blogs working on all this that I can’t wait to hear what you think. If only I could write every day, all day! Ha. Have a great night— Cara
Perfect! Thank you so much
LS was really handcuffed in writing season 11 because of the writer's strike. So I think that's why she didn't have a hand in episode 12.
Hey Jessica. Good point. Can you tell me more about this and the timing. I’m trying to think who this affected and who it didn’t as much. I think it still says an awful lot that it was this good even with that happening. The planning and work put in to that point— know Kevin mentioned having a little more free reign than normal too because of strike. Thanks for commenting! Always like all the different insights and layers. Why I like to blog— others help me think of things I didn’t. Add to it or point out things I could change. It’s awesome!